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How fucking hard is it to say mass-murdering civilians is bad, in general? Hamas, at best, can say they have no other means of effective resistance… and we can point out how this last effort’s gone sooo well for Palestine. Israel on other hand needs to stop doing war crimes, put Bibi’s corrupt ass in a fucking jail cell, and get out of the running for most authoritarian middle-eastern government. They’re not in the lead - but they’re not fuckin’ last.
How fucking hard is it to say mass-murdering civilians is bad, in general?
Not that hard, but that’s not enough. Social media is full of people saying exactly that and getting hounded off the platform for it.
There is no way to make a statement on this topic that will definitely not get you in trouble.
I understand organizations just choosing to say nothing.
Mandatory service in army doing war crimes on the regular, courts falling under right-wing control because apparently that’s the style of the time, constantly declaring any criticism or even the barest sympathy for Palestinians as intolerable antisemitism deserving retribution…
Just because Netanyahu hasn’t had anyone sawed to pieces doesn’t mean the state isn’t all kinds of fucked up. Egypt’s a barely functional military-run bureaucracy, and they manage to commit considerably fewer genocide-adjacent activities.
Are you suggesting that there is a connection between genocidal attacks on a people and their population growth?
And do you really think that the peoples with the highest birth rates are doing best?
Would you mind explaining how you came to this conclusion?
Because I actually believe that, on the contrary, the peoples with the fewest children are doing best.
Are you aware of the fact that there are more Jewish people living on this planet than ever before?
Do you really want to deny the Holocaust based on this fact?
I completely agree but according to the V-Dem Democracy Index from Wikipedia they have infact been the most democratic country of the middle east by a lot in 2023
It’s hard to call out Hamas because Israel keeps throwing rocks at the hornet’s nest. Israel has the real political and military power here, but they aren’t putting in the real effort that would be needed to change the situation. Bombing civilians is just creating more extremists as kids see their parents and siblings killed by the IDF; they aren’t going to grow up and say, wow, what Hamas did was awful, and I guess my family deserved to die because of that. No, they’re going to hate Israel.
Israel isn’t bombing civilians. Seriously, have you seen the picutres? If they wanted to hit civilians even the vastly inflated death tolls made up by Hamas would be a gross underestatement.
What they’re bombing is the enemy that just murdered more than a thousand civilians. And it’s Hamas terrorist who are literally guiding the bombs towards civilians.
say they have no other means of effective resistance
Self immulation would be a better way to resist. They chose to give one the world’s deadliest armies a reason and political cover to kill them.
If Israel were ready to commit genocide (fortunately it isn’t), they’d just have signed the death warrant of the Palestinian people.
And what are they doing now? The only difference is that Hamas burning themselves might wouldn’t involve murdering countless civilians on both sides and that it might actually help their cause.
Edit: I’m not saying they should burn themselves. What they should do is the right thing, i.e. exactly what Germany did on May 8th 1945. That’s the only way out of this mess. Maybe they’ll sooner or later realize that getting bombed is simply what the return of the terror they unleashed it on your neighbors. We did here in Germany.
Israel’s bombing civilians indiscriminately and you’re blaming the Palestinians for resisting in a way besides killing themselves. You literally suggested self immolation. You explicitly said, literally killing themselves would be less futile than violence at the border.
I cannot imagine the belief set necessary to think that’s a defense.
So they’ve killed over a thousand people, bombed apartments to dust, demanded a whole city depopulate overnight, bombed the places those refugees were told to go, bombed the border crossings, etc., etc., etc. - and that’s deliberate. That’s the measured response! That’s what they did on purpose, with forethought.
And you suggested those victims of collateral damage should have SET THEMSELVES ON FIRE and DIED IN PROTEST, because that would’ve gone better. Like they should be thankful that Israel’s not, in your own words, ready to commit genocide.
This is the shit I would say as a vicious condemnation of Israel. This is damning criticism of their conduct, when they have all the land and all the power and all the money, and their victims primarily resist by throwing rocks. How in the name of god do you write this crap and still think that’s positive, for Israel?
Where do you get off comparing-- “the return of the terror they unleashed it on your neighbors,” meaning Palestine, terrorizing Israel?! Israel! The modern military discriminately blowing up apartments! The force you glibly suggest could end it all - “otherwise this would be over!” - with just a little killing the entire population?
How fucking hard is it to say mass-murdering civilians is bad, in general? Hamas, at best, can say they have no other means of effective resistance… and we can point out how this last effort’s gone sooo well for Palestine. Israel on other hand needs to stop doing war crimes, put Bibi’s corrupt ass in a fucking jail cell, and get out of the running for most authoritarian middle-eastern government. They’re not in the lead - but they’re not fuckin’ last.
Not that hard, but that’s not enough. Social media is full of people saying exactly that and getting hounded off the platform for it.
There is no way to make a statement on this topic that will definitely not get you in trouble.
I understand organizations just choosing to say nothing.
The Onion has been predictably merciless on that front.
Haha are you serious? Israel’s government and society are in an entirely different ballpark when it comes to liberty about anything for anybody.
Mandatory service in army doing war crimes on the regular, courts falling under right-wing control because apparently that’s the style of the time, constantly declaring any criticism or even the barest sympathy for Palestinians as intolerable antisemitism deserving retribution…
Just because Netanyahu hasn’t had anyone sawed to pieces doesn’t mean the state isn’t all kinds of fucked up. Egypt’s a barely functional military-run bureaucracy, and they manage to commit considerably fewer genocide-adjacent activities.
Yeah, Israel is genociding so hard and so successfully that the Arab population in Israel grows the fastest.
Are you suggesting that there is a connection between genocidal attacks on a people and their population growth? And do you really think that the peoples with the highest birth rates are doing best? Would you mind explaining how you came to this conclusion? Because I actually believe that, on the contrary, the peoples with the fewest children are doing best.
Jesus fuck, please make clear you have “birth-rates” memorized, in your argument about who’s a bigot.
I don’t even know what you’re trying to tell me with that.
Good on you for keeping the oldschool Internet discussion culture alive with senseless cursing.
You want it dry?
Your argument is an irrelevant fallacy, and you should feel bad.
I am unimpressed by your tone policing.
Genocide means the killing of an ethnicity. Arab birth rates in Israel are flourishing. Hence, Israel is doing a bad job at eradicating them.
Are you aware of the fact that there are more Jewish people living on this planet than ever before? Do you really want to deny the Holocaust based on this fact?
And that makes eradicating Palestine okay, apparently.
Everybody relax! More similar-looking brown people we born nearby, so the hundreds killed just this month do not count.
I completely agree but according to the V-Dem Democracy Index from Wikipedia they have infact been the most democratic country of the middle east by a lot in 2023
Was that the metric I condemned?
It’s hard to call out Hamas because Israel keeps throwing rocks at the hornet’s nest. Israel has the real political and military power here, but they aren’t putting in the real effort that would be needed to change the situation. Bombing civilians is just creating more extremists as kids see their parents and siblings killed by the IDF; they aren’t going to grow up and say, wow, what Hamas did was awful, and I guess my family deserved to die because of that. No, they’re going to hate Israel.
Israel isn’t bombing civilians. Seriously, have you seen the picutres? If they wanted to hit civilians even the vastly inflated death tolls made up by Hamas would be a gross underestatement.
What they’re bombing is the enemy that just murdered more than a thousand civilians. And it’s Hamas terrorist who are literally guiding the bombs towards civilians.
Self immulation would be a better way to resist. They chose to give one the world’s deadliest armies a reason and political cover to kill them. If Israel were ready to commit genocide (fortunately it isn’t), they’d just have signed the death warrant of the Palestinian people.
‘Set yourself on fire or else the military might eradicate your entire population,’ says someone with negative self-awareness.
I’m saying setting themselves on fire would actually classify as resistance because it wouldn’t be entirely futile. Attacking Israel is futile.
‘You know what’s not futile? Die in agony.’
Get out.
And what are they doing now? The only difference is that Hamas burning themselves might wouldn’t involve murdering countless civilians on both sides and that it might actually help their cause.
Edit: I’m not saying they should burn themselves. What they should do is the right thing, i.e. exactly what Germany did on May 8th 1945. That’s the only way out of this mess. Maybe they’ll sooner or later realize that getting bombed is simply what the return of the terror they unleashed it on your neighbors. We did here in Germany.
Israel’s bombing civilians indiscriminately and you’re blaming the Palestinians for resisting in a way besides killing themselves. You literally suggested self immolation. You explicitly said, literally killing themselves would be less futile than violence at the border.
And you think that makes Hamas the Nazi analogue.
They aren’t. Otherwise this would be over.
I cannot imagine the belief set necessary to think that’s a defense.
So they’ve killed over a thousand people, bombed apartments to dust, demanded a whole city depopulate overnight, bombed the places those refugees were told to go, bombed the border crossings, etc., etc., etc. - and that’s deliberate. That’s the measured response! That’s what they did on purpose, with forethought.
And you suggested those victims of collateral damage should have SET THEMSELVES ON FIRE and DIED IN PROTEST, because that would’ve gone better. Like they should be thankful that Israel’s not, in your own words, ready to commit genocide.
This is the shit I would say as a vicious condemnation of Israel. This is damning criticism of their conduct, when they have all the land and all the power and all the money, and their victims primarily resist by throwing rocks. How in the name of god do you write this crap and still think that’s positive, for Israel?
Where do you get off comparing-- “the return of the terror they unleashed it on your neighbors,” meaning Palestine, terrorizing Israel?! Israel! The modern military discriminately blowing up apartments! The force you glibly suggest could end it all - “otherwise this would be over!” - with just a little killing the entire population?