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I agree that the system is absolute dogshit in NYC, but how do you go about fixing that? Xinjiang had the benefit of being brand new, so there were no existing travelers, and it’s not like you can just close down a station in NYC and say “Oopsie; get fucked everyone who used this line/station, come back in a few weeks/months”.
It’s pretty much like that, then like someone else said you provide a bus route between the two stations. It’s an inconvenience but has to happen at some time.
For smaller repairs like painting you an paint half of the station while keeping the other half operational, then finish the job some days later.
It sounds very easy on paper, but that suggestion is just horrifically infeasible. It’s not that it’s an inconvenience, it’s just much more complicated and logistically impossible then how you’re portraying it.
If you’re talking about the bus route then you just don’t know what you’re talking about. Like others have said it already happens in Moscow and DC, and I can add my own experience with Athens.
Obviously if they want to do repairs or maintenance they don’t close one station, they close part of the line and replace it with an express bus line. Yes it’s slower and will make traffic worse but it simply must happen at some time.
Going by your logic, creating a subway system in a city with traffic issues is a “lose lose” because the roadworks will make traffic worse for a couple of years.
I’m not making excuses. I mean currently with the resources and systems available, it is not possible.
You’re right, the government does not care about public transit.
Do you think this is a group decision or something?
“Local incompetence? Lack of political will? Fuck off, I’m sure the people working 50 hours a week and poverty wage jobs are absolutely roaring with energy to fight for public transit.
Good luck getting that to ever happen in the United States. Also buses would be very impractical and near impossible to cover long distances.
Plus traffic.
As an edit: I’m not saying that busses are bad or impractical. They’re the best form of short range public transit. I’m saying that buses in the this scenario would be extremely impractical and logistically impossible to implement.
The people here have never driven through gridlocked rush hour traffic on the Manhattan or Brooklyn bridges, and think that a bus is going to magically make it to its destination without getting stuck for hours or chasing traffic jams on its own.
That depends heavily on the Burrough. Plus there are several spots of the Bronx and Brooklyn that are complete dead zones because the stations are in poor working class areas, and not the ultra wealthy areas in Queens and Manhattan (where surprisingly enough the stations can be beautiful and well maintained because well…. Rich people serving their own)
I disagree. The best form of short range public transit is the cross breed of a streetcar and a wedge-type snowplow. Forget stopping for cars that ignore the “red light for streetcar crossing” lights, just bifurcate them and keep moving.
You hire a Chinese railroad contractor, you close it from 1-5am on a Sunday, and then you reopen it and inaugurate the extra Maglev platform that connects it to Rio de Janeiro
What? That’s exactly what happens. Various stations in Washington DC have been closed, for 6+ months at a time, the past two years, for renovations. They made do with route workaround and shuttles in the meantime. Are you implying stations shouldn’t update just because it might cause inconvenience? Safety trumps inconvenience.
Where did I say that we should update because of inconvenience???
I’m saying that millions of people every day rely on these stations to get to work, school, stores etc, and it is to far to walk or bike; and many of them cannot afford a cab or Uber, let alone own a car.
I’m saying that it feels impossible to close down a station without disenfranchising a quite massive amount of people with no other options.
Also where did I mention safety at all?
This isn’t an issue of convenience; it’s an issue of “life or death”, “Oops sorry! Can’t get to your job anymore because the nearest station is closed? Tough luck!”
True, but logistically how would that be viable? Buses would be highly impractical on the vast majority of road due to traffic, and the sheer amount of people that would require shuttles, and what “other transportation”? That’s all that’s there is. People can’t afford cabs, Ubers, or cars, and the distance is to great (or just straight dangerous) to walk or bike.
You can’t just reverse decades of car centric and awful infrastructure with an easy fix.
On a station level basis, even if you can’t do servicing piecemeal (refurbish the northbound platform, then the southbound one), most subways have stops within “walk but somewhat inconvenient” distance-- 1km or less apart. You can often annoy out-of-towners by giving them an itinerary that results in them changing trains three times and spending 45 minutes to get between two stations within line of sight of each other.
But seriously, for people with extreme access needs, I wonder if putting a few of those “multi row golf cart” style mini electric vehicles looping around could provide stopgap service to the nearest operating station.
We already need some degree of spare capacity; how does the service survive in the event of an accident if there’s no double-tracking?
Wait, I know this one. Toronto intended to retire an entire subway line in late 2023 (claiming it was already past the end-of-life for the equipment, and promising it would be replaced with new subways in 2030. They ended up shuttering it months earlier because of a derailment. (https://www.ttc.ca/about-the-ttc/projects-and-plans/Future-of-Line-3-Scarborough)
I agree that the system is absolute dogshit in NYC, but how do you go about fixing that? Xinjiang had the benefit of being brand new, so there were no existing travelers, and it’s not like you can just close down a station in NYC and say “Oopsie; get fucked everyone who used this line/station, come back in a few weeks/months”.
It’s a lose lose.
It’s pretty much like that, then like someone else said you provide a bus route between the two stations. It’s an inconvenience but has to happen at some time.
For smaller repairs like painting you an paint half of the station while keeping the other half operational, then finish the job some days later.
It sounds very easy on paper, but that suggestion is just horrifically infeasible. It’s not that it’s an inconvenience, it’s just much more complicated and logistically impossible then how you’re portraying it.
If you’re talking about the bus route then you just don’t know what you’re talking about. Like others have said it already happens in Moscow and DC, and I can add my own experience with Athens.
Obviously if they want to do repairs or maintenance they don’t close one station, they close part of the line and replace it with an express bus line. Yes it’s slower and will make traffic worse but it simply must happen at some time.
Going by your logic, creating a subway system in a city with traffic issues is a “lose lose” because the roadworks will make traffic worse for a couple of years.
deleted by creator
I’m not making excuses. I mean currently with the resources and systems available, it is not possible.
You’re right, the government does not care about public transit.
Do you think this is a group decision or something?
“Local incompetence? Lack of political will? Fuck off, I’m sure the people working 50 hours a week and poverty wage jobs are absolutely roaring with energy to fight for public transit.
Imagine blaming the people.
When stations are repaired in Moscow, they are completely closed and some kind of bus route is launched, where you can travel with a metro ticket.
Good luck getting that to ever happen in the United States. Also buses would be very impractical and near impossible to cover long distances.
Plus traffic.
As an edit: I’m not saying that busses are bad or impractical. They’re the best form of short range public transit. I’m saying that buses in the this scenario would be extremely impractical and logistically impossible to implement.
The people here have never driven through gridlocked rush hour traffic on the Manhattan or Brooklyn bridges, and think that a bus is going to magically make it to its destination without getting stuck for hours or chasing traffic jams on its own.
You only have to go to the next station, which if we’re talking about NYC metro, shouldn’t be that far away
That depends heavily on the Burrough. Plus there are several spots of the Bronx and Brooklyn that are complete dead zones because the stations are in poor working class areas, and not the ultra wealthy areas in Queens and Manhattan (where surprisingly enough the stations can be beautiful and well maintained because well…. Rich people serving their own)
I disagree. The best form of short range public transit is the cross breed of a streetcar and a wedge-type snowplow. Forget stopping for cars that ignore the “red light for streetcar crossing” lights, just bifurcate them and keep moving.
You hire a Chinese railroad contractor, you close it from 1-5am on a Sunday, and then you reopen it and inaugurate the extra Maglev platform that connects it to Rio de Janeiro
I wish 😔
What? That’s exactly what happens. Various stations in Washington DC have been closed, for 6+ months at a time, the past two years, for renovations. They made do with route workaround and shuttles in the meantime. Are you implying stations shouldn’t update just because it might cause inconvenience? Safety trumps inconvenience.
Where did I say that we should update because of inconvenience???
I’m saying that millions of people every day rely on these stations to get to work, school, stores etc, and it is to far to walk or bike; and many of them cannot afford a cab or Uber, let alone own a car.
I’m saying that it feels impossible to close down a station without disenfranchising a quite massive amount of people with no other options.
Also where did I mention safety at all?
This isn’t an issue of convenience; it’s an issue of “life or death”, “Oops sorry! Can’t get to your job anymore because the nearest station is closed? Tough luck!”
Also imagine comparing DC to New York lmaoooo
Unless it’s due to the edit, their post mentions other options: the city provides shuttles or other transportation so you can get to the next station
True, but logistically how would that be viable? Buses would be highly impractical on the vast majority of road due to traffic, and the sheer amount of people that would require shuttles, and what “other transportation”? That’s all that’s there is. People can’t afford cabs, Ubers, or cars, and the distance is to great (or just straight dangerous) to walk or bike.
You can’t just reverse decades of car centric and awful infrastructure with an easy fix.
New York City already has a bus system. This isn’t asking them to invent something totally new.
Trust me. The city may as well not have a bus system. It exists in name only, and I would not trust it to get me anywhere.
On a station level basis, even if you can’t do servicing piecemeal (refurbish the northbound platform, then the southbound one), most subways have stops within “walk but somewhat inconvenient” distance-- 1km or less apart. You can often annoy out-of-towners by giving them an itinerary that results in them changing trains three times and spending 45 minutes to get between two stations within line of sight of each other.
But seriously, for people with extreme access needs, I wonder if putting a few of those “multi row golf cart” style mini electric vehicles looping around could provide stopgap service to the nearest operating station.
We already need some degree of spare capacity; how does the service survive in the event of an accident if there’s no double-tracking?
Wait, I know this one. Toronto intended to retire an entire subway line in late 2023 (claiming it was already past the end-of-life for the equipment, and promising it would be replaced with new subways in 2030. They ended up shuttering it months earlier because of a derailment. (https://www.ttc.ca/about-the-ttc/projects-and-plans/Future-of-Line-3-Scarborough)